0:00
100% we had a tick weaponization program and what went wrong with Lyme disease, which many say is the most controversial disease in America right now.
Why has the medical establishment been so slow on this, and why did they lead so many people like yourself to think that they had a psychological problem instead of a physical one?
0:17
When my husband and I got it, we felt like we had early onset Alzheimer's.
I would forget what the red, green and yellow meant on a traffic light.
I mean something as basic as that.
I'm dealing with up level ticks with up level pathogens in quantities that are nothing like the world I grew up in.
0:35
After I almost died from these two tick borne diseases, I thought, you know, my life means absolutely nothing unless I do something significant and and that significant thing seem like I don't want any other family to go through what we went through.
It was such a brutal nightmare.
0:53
Kris Newby is an award-winning science writer and the senior producer of the Lyme disease documentary Under Our Skin, a 2010 Oscar semi finalist.
Her first book, Bitten, The Secret History of Lyme Disease and Biological Weapons, won three International Book Awards for journalism and narrative non fiction.
1:12
She has two engineering degrees and has worked as a science and technology writer for Stanford Medical School, Apple, and other Silicon Valley companies.
Kris Newby, welcome to the show.
Thank you.
It's really awesome to have you here.
I really enjoyed your book.
1:28
That was your first book.
Yeah.
And I'm I'm just finishing up a second one.
What's the topic for the second book?
It's the Skull Valley Incident of 1968 and March of 19686000 pregnant sheep dropped dead in the Utah desert.
1:46
And it's the unfolding of that mystery, which, like Benton, is about a military experiment gone wrong.
Yeah, such an interesting time for this conversation.
I was just watching yesterday as Anthony Fauci was pleading the 5th over and over and over again before Congress.
2:04
You know, and it seems like we're in this era where so many things that were fringe conspiracy theories before unfortunately turn out to be true.
And there's like a shifting in the consensus mindset of Americans right now as we kind of grapple with the fact that a lot of these things are in fact true.
2:20
They did in fact happen.
And I think that really leads to talking about your book a little bit.
Could you give us a quick overview summary of what Benton is about?
And then I'll kind of dive into some of my more specific questions.
Sure, it starts with my family's experience with Lyme disease.
2:37
So we went to Martha's Vineyard, my husband and I were bitten, we came back to California, and we had a nightmare experience in the medical system.
The the heart of the book is really my sleuthing as to what went wrong with Lyme disease, which many say is the most controversial disease in America right now, except for COVID usurped that.
3:01
But and it's about the life of Willie Burgdorfer who was brought over from Switzerland.
He was a tick specialist.
He's brought over in the bio weapons program and he's the discoverer of Lyme disease.
And during my research, he ended up telling me that I was 2 decades in the bio weapons program, stuffing fleas, ticks and mosquitoes with dangerous organisms so we could drop them on our enemies.
3:25
So that's, and it's really his character art.
He's Hark, he's an interesting person.
He, he was excited to come to America and live in a beautiful place, the Bitterroot Valley in Montana.
And then as he matured and realized what he was really doing as far as an bioethical standpoint, he had a change of heart and he talked to journalists like me and exposed the program, which ended theoretically in 68.
3:58
Yeah, You know, I was AI was public speaking in the health field for a couple of decades all around Canada and the US And I remember when people started talking to me about Lyme disease and my initial impressions were based on what was, it was people who would come up to me to say they had Lyme disease and that they had it long term.
4:18
And they did come across to me very often like crazy people.
And I heard so much chatter about that that I thought, yeah, this is, you know, do you remember that sort of era when, when a lot of people had fibromyalgia, they had chronic fatigue syndrome?
You'd hear a lot of that.
And it was like, I would often feel like, am I dealing with a crazy person here, or am I dealing with a person who has, like, some occult illness that they can't quite figure out what it is?
4:40
And took some time for me to sort through some of that.
And I had something really similar with Lyme disease.
And I remember at some point being like, I need to learn more.
And your documentary had just come out.
And so that was the first exposure I actually had.
So it's really cool because recently I read Bitten and I realized, oh, that was you who who worked on that film.
4:56
But that film really helped me to understand.
So first wanted to say thank you for that.
And I think now Americans understand what Lyme disease is, but it is still a challenge when talking to people in the medical field.
Why are they so slow?
And in fact, let you know.
5:12
I'll also say that I remember toward the end of that film, if I recall correctly, I think you guys had exposed that many of the people who were in charge, many of the doctors in charge of policy had some kind of perverse incentive or some kind of relationship with the genetic, the genome of the spirochete itself.
5:30
So what is that related?
Why?
Why is the medical establishment been so slow on this?
And and why did they lead so many people like yourself to think that they had a psychological problem instead of a physical one?
Well, when it ticked by Chew, it numbs your skin and it suppresses your immune system for about a week.
5:50
And ticks can harbor in the US 20 different pathogens.
There is a high probability that you'll get more than one.
And that creates a very confusing set of symptoms.
And your typical doctor, Gray haired today spent maybe 15 minutes on Lyme disease in Med school and there's no way they can.
6:15
They understand the complexities of the mix of pathogens you get like Lyme disease is very neuroinvasive.
Within 48 hours, it creeps into your brain and immune protected sites like joints with scar tissue and anything that's in your head is can make you look a little crazy.
6:39
You know, like when my husband and I got it, we felt like we had early and onset Alzheimer's.
I would forget what the red, green and yellow meant on a traffic light.
I mean, something as basic as that.
I was a danger on the road.
My husband would lose sense of place and time.
6:58
It's basically brain on fire.
And then since it's attracted to your nervous system, you would have twitches, gut problems, chronic fatigue like symptoms.
So it's and fibromyalgia, it's very, it's misdiagnosed a lot.
7:17
Then you add if you have another Co infection that even makes diagnosis harder and the symptoms change from day-to-day.
So of course doctors or your neighbors or your loved ones might think you're a little, you're a hypochondriac.
7:33
And that certainly that's how I was labeled.
It took us a year, 10 doctors and $60,000 just to get diagnosed.
Then it took five years of on and off antibiotic treatment to get back to normal.
7:51
So.
And is that with with drugs like doxycycline I'm assuming?
Doxycycline is good in the beginning, but when you're in the advanced stages, the chronic stages, it's good to have two different antibiotics that you pulse on and off 1 gets past the blood brain barrier.
8:12
One treats the Lyme disease when it goes into cyst form.
So a lot of times when you blast it with something like doxycycline, the spirochetes go into little hard balls or they go into biofilm balls and a normal antibiotic can't reach it.
So then you would use a cyst Buster antibiotic like Flagyl.
8:33
OK.
So that's why just like if you got an aggressive brain tumor, you would want someone who had gotten those under that particular cancer under control with tick borne diseases.
If you go to an infectious disease doctor, you might not be served because you've been indoctrinated with the Infectious Diseases Society of America, who in the very beginning stressed vaccines over a methodical treatment of antibiotics off patent antibiotics.
9:06
Reading your I, I, I first want to say just an impressive first book.
I really.
Yeah.
And I the the very vivid description you gave of the process by which the tick gets on you and then and then begins to feed on you and and take its blood meal, kind of sci-fi horror, almost like reading that you did such a great.
9:27
Yeah, yeah.
And then.
But I listening to the medical narrative of you and you and your husband's story was kind of infuriating, you know, and I've watched so many people go through it now over the years.
I live up in Maine.
And so we are now.
I I just learned recently that it's not true that my backyard is the source of all tics.
9:47
I was sure that it was because of how many are here, but but we are certainly like in that area now where it's very routine for people to not only be bitten, but to get Lyme disease here.
So it was very infuriating, like hearing how you were treated and sort of what you went through it and the journey that you had to go on, which seemed like a lot really kind of like a self healing journey to a degree.
10:07
Anything you want to just say about that for somebody who's listening, who's maybe in that journey or has somebody in their life in that journey, Is there any kind of thing you might offer to help shortcut that for them?
Something I've talked about over the years is how few wild foods still make it into our global marketplace.
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Yeah, I mean, go to your trusted Dr. and if you get stonewalled or are told it's all in your head and, and trust your instincts, you know, like you know your body better than anybody else or your children's bodies.
I I've heard so many sad stories about children with these diseases, especially when you mix Lyme disease with Bartonella, which creates neuropsychiatric pans panda symptoms.
11:52
So anyways, I would say try your main line physician, but then educate yourself.
So go to likelymedisease.org, which is the biggest Lyme patient advocacy.
Grew up and read the symptoms.
There's a questionnaire and go arm to your doctor to say this is what I think I have because this is the set of symptoms I haven't realized.
12:14
That doctor maybe spent 15 minutes on tick diseases.
Maybe they're in California and they've hardly seen any cases.
And then if you get the specialist runaround, that's going to be really expensive.
Some of my richest friends went down blind alleys because of the specialist thing.
12:33
We have a very fragmented medical system right now divided into specialist and they only see part of your body.
They don't put the whole thing together.
And that's where tick specialist can help you.
And at lymedisease.org you can find a doctor in your area, probably so.
12:51
And then just know you're going to have to fight for the for a diagnosis.
There are better labs than others and the specialty labs like Igenics and there's a couple other Galaxy and Igenics.
They test for tick borne diseases and they test for more species of Borrelia than just LabCorp Quest.
13:16
They they test for the new strain that's been found in California, Borrelia and Miyama Toy.
They might test for relapsing fever, which is on the West Coast and can kill you really quickly.
It's a quick feeding tick.
13:31
It's spread by a quick feeding tick in a cabin in the Sierras, something like that. 20 minutes.
They're in and out, and then you have these little spirochetes swimming freely in your blood and giving you relapsing fevers.
Is it accurate to say something that I have always read and heard about spirochetes?
13:51
Is that similar to let's say like another spirochetal illness like syphilis, where the the shape of the Organism itself, that kind of coiled spiral allows it to bore its way into tissues that would otherwise be difficult to access?
Like for instance, into the synovial fluid in a joint capsule or like you said, into the the nervous system itself, places where maybe you wouldn't normally get bacteria.
14:15
And, and is it also true that that would make it more difficult to treat them with antibiotics because they're in non vascularized parts of the body?
Exactly.
Exactly.
So they're like the coil in a, a wine cork.
14:31
You know, it's a mechanical, it gives them mechanical advantage to drill through.
They're also coated with a slime that is very similar to the myelin sheath in your nervous, in your nerve, you know, like dissolves like slippery it gets.
14:49
It.
Yeah.
This year was, you know, right now we're talking and it's that nice, at least up in here in Maine, it's that nice lull in the season.
So about a month ago, we were in the thick of it, you know, just seeing dozens of ticks every day.
And now we're in a nice quiet moment.
15:04
But I'm always like gearing up now because come September, we got our next flush, you know, and the heat and the humidity kind of are the dryness kind of dies down and then they're back out.
But I mean, it is, it is just a part of my day now to encounter 10 ticks, 20 ticks on me.
15:20
And then also that's not counting what's on my dogs climbing up my walls.
I mean I just find them everywhere.
It's gotten very severe now.
Anecdotally, I have the memory of my entire childhood.
I remember 1 tick one time.
Same here, I remember 0 ticks and so it is different.
15:38
It's not your imagination.
They're telling me that now actually, I've heard two stories.
One is I hear climate change, which seems like this thing you just throw at anything these days, like, oh, that's just climate change, right?
It's like something on fire.
Oh, it's climate change, like, OK, whatever that means.
But I also hear, well, we've we've altered habitat, created so much suburban edge habitat, it's led to booms in the white tailed deer population, etcetera, etcetera.
16:05
I'm struggling with this.
I'm my, I would say that I know people with a much keener nature observation than I have, but I probably have a little bit more than the average person.
And I as I'm out a lot and I just struggle to imagine that, you know, malls and suburbs have led to this boom in ticks.
16:24
Like what do you think has led to this year?
I mean, one of the worst I've ever seen, if not the worst I've ever seen.
And it does seem like every year, not only is it worse, but I here where I live, we start to get our first ticks while they're still piles of snow in my driveway, you know, and then we don't stop seeing them until this is a frozen landscape.
16:42
Like it just because it's snow doesn't mean I'm not going to see ticks again.
So we, we have them.
I mean, winters are real reprieve.
You know, why is there so many ticks right now?
And it does it relate to these bio weapons programs?
Are there kind of two things going on at the same time?
Well, nature's complex.
17:00
There's multiple things going on.
It is climate change.
It is people living in the forest.
It is overpopulation of deer.
But as my family was suffering, I started, I'm an engineer by training.
I started researching, going down the rabbit holes and I think a big driver for the red meat allergy alpha gal.
17:20
And this spread of ticks is an experiment that was conducted in the late 60s, which was the height of the bioweapons program.
And at that time they were trying to weaponize ticks for dropping on our enemies like Vietnam and the Soviet Union.
17:40
And they were looking for the perfect tick for those different climates and they were injecting different pathogens in them.
So one experiment that was Army funded and funded by the Atomic Energy Commission was at Old Dominion University on on near Newport News, VA, near Norfolk and Newport News.
18:03
And in that experiments it went for several years.
And this professor got ticks from Willieburg, Darfur, the discoverer from Montana.
And he they were pregnant or gravid ticks and he injected them with radioactive iodine and other isotopes.
18:23
And then when the when the tick laid its 2003 thousand 4000 eggs, all the nymphs would be radioactive for the rest of their lives.
So why was he doing that?
He gridded off some swampy fields in Virginia and then put 1000 ticks in each square and he would go away for a month and come back and collect the ticks in one square and put them in a little test tube.
18:50
Take him to the lab.
Use a Geiger Geiger counter because the radioactivity was proportion proportional to how many ticks were in the the grid.
He would write down in his notebook how you know how far the ticks spread over the month.
And this went on for years.
He put those ticks back in the square for the adults that he caught there.
19:10
He would paint them with fluorescent paint so he could also use a black light to see how they'd spread.
And so this was important to the military because they wanted to know if they're dropping ticks on enemies, how far will the ticks spread before their ground invasion.
19:27
So the problem with that experiment, I mean, they they released ticks open air in Montana and in Virginia, but they used in Virginia a non-native tick.
So this is the Lone Star tick.
Before the set of experiments, lone stars were way S established way South of the Mason Dixon line.
19:47
And they're very aggressive ticks.
They fight fire ants effectively, and they're also the only tick in North America that has rudimentary eyes on their shoulders.
So they, so they don't just like passively sit on a blade of grass with their sticky pads out waiting for you to pass.
20:11
They stalk and swarm.
They used to call it bullish fever in Texas because you're all of a sudden you look down and your legs were covered in these ticks.
I had an uncle went to Miami and he had the same thing.
And then he ended up getting really, really sick.
So anyways, they released these non-native ticks and part of this professor's job was to see how far the ticks would spread by birds.
20:35
So he or another colleague determined that it took five days for a bird with possibly with tick hitchhikers to go up to Long Island, Connecticut.
And so that's Long Island is right near Lyme, CT, it's right across Long Island Sound.
20:53
And all of a sudden a year after his series of experiments, there was an outbreak of Lone Star ticks, these really aggressive and that's about the time they stopped DDT spraying.
So I think what you saw is aggressive ticks are taking over the native territory of the deer ticks.
21:14
And since pathogens specialize in certain species of ticks, which your your former interviewee at Amherst probably told you about, it's typically one parasite inside of one tick that evolves symbiotically over years and years and decades and decades.
21:33
But now they were just mixing up nature, nature like that.
So you had the Lone Stars and what they carried are Rocky Mountain spotted fever, which is the most deadly tick borne disease in North America.
You get spotted fever, rugged amount of spotted fever and you can be in a coma and dead in 14 days.
21:53
And So what Long Island saw all of a sudden because of the migratory birds was they would go from one or two cases of spotted fever, probably people who'd been hiking in the Rockies to 147 cases and people dying.
22:10
So that's part of what alerted people to the tick problem.
But at the same time, in the same sort of late 60s, we also had an outbreak of this crazy new Lyme arthritis was what they called Lyme arthritis right around Lyme, CT And Yale was investigating that.
22:32
And then there was another weird disease that just popped up, which was babesiosis.
It's a cattle parasite.
And this was like one of the first instances were crossed over to man.
So right within a tiny little few months, like maybe a 10 mile circle, 3 freaky tick borne diseases show up right near Plum Island which was the anti animal bioweapons headquarters for quite a few years.
23:03
And which is also less than 10 miles from Lyme, CT, right, the Plum Island facility.
Right.
So you would think that people would connect the dots, but there's about 6 states around there, New England states, the colonies, and they had different health departments and over 8 years, nobody could figure it out.
23:25
But because of the spotted fever, Willy Burgdorfer in Montana had taken over the the Rickettsio group, which is the spotted fever group.
And he was brought in to investigate the Rickettsil outbreak.
And that's where he discovered Lyme disease in the mid gut of the tick.
23:47
Now as I got deep into bitten, he, he told me and another journalist, well, there was another germ there.
It wasn't just Lyme disease.
It was making people really, really sick around Lyme, CT, Long Island and New Jersey.
24:07
There was something else there.
He wouldn't tell me exactly what it is, but when I got his lab notebooks, I realized that in the middle of the investigation, he spent a couple months in Switzerland and collected an Organism very similar to the ones inside the ticks around Lyme, CT and the the mysterious Rickettsl around Lyme, CT.
24:34
He had tested against all, all known US strains, including the weaponized strains, and it came out the null set.
But when he went to Europe and collected those Rickettsles and made a test based on on those, they, they were the same basically.
24:51
So he nicknamed that Swiss agent.
And because I got an early draft of his discovery article, I saw that he included like a good scientist.
Yeah, people are really sick in Lyme, CT.
I found this spirochete, but there was another Organism and that could be part of what was making people sick.
25:13
But in the final draft that was strucken, stricken and Willie May, I was told to disappear that.
He would have had secret clearances, so anything he published had to have been there must have been government oversight on all his studies I would assume and.
25:32
Yeah.
So this was involved at that time, that's when AIDS showed up, Legionnaires.
It was a time with lots of strange diseases, right.
And CDC, I mean, it was originally formed after World War 2 as a paramilitary organizations to investigate suspicious outbreaks.
25:53
Is it natural or man made?
And during the course of my research, I talked to someone from Fort Dietrich who is a an investigator that explores that.
And he had eight points that indicate, you know, it could be suspicious.
26:10
And five of them came up hits with the lime outbreak, which is a point source like on my Chris Newby website.
I, I took all the earliest cases and, and animated them.
And you can see Lyme disease started right at the mouth of the Connecticut River right across from Plum Island right near the Pfizer plant.
26:32
It was working on antibiotics for the, the war effort and, and it's spread, spread, spread.
So that's why the front wave just like any outbreak as it spreads the front way of their sicker animals and people and then in the middle sometimes they become immune.
26:54
And So what we're seeing right now from that point outbreak is it's hitting Maine and Canada right now the the heartland states, South Carolina, Georgia.
And that's why it it just seems like it's more of a problem used to be because it is.
27:17
Yeah, OK, I, I want to disambiguate a few things I'm hearing here.
They're a little confused in my mind.
So first I want to say Willie Burgdorfer.
He, you know, the lime spirochete is named after him, right?
So he, he, I assume, named it.
27:33
So just I want people to connect that when when you're talking about him, you're talking about the guy that named Lyme disease.
So I think it's like people need to know this is the guy.
And if I understand what you're saying, he was a researcher out of Switzerland, did you say?
27:51
Well, he's trained in Switzerland.
He was brought out 51 specifically to work on the bio weapons program because he knew Q fever and ticks.
OK.
So he has like kind of a, a career that's front facing in a kind of hidden career with the military at the same time.
28:10
All right, here's what I want to disambiguate.
I I'm trying to understand if we're talking about any gain of function and if we are or, or whatever kind of that means, you know, a colloquial meaning of that.
Are we talking about of the vector, in other words, the tick or are we talking about the pathogens in the tick or are we not talking about gain of function at all and we're talking about just sort of mix and matching, putting pathogens in different organisms and seeing what will happen?
28:40
Because one question I have, are you familiar with the domestication study on silver foxes that happened in Siberia?
Have you ever seen anything about that?
Yes.
OK, so so you know, like they're taking hey, who are the nice ones?
Put them in the over here and breed them.
Who are the mean ones?
Put them over here and breed them.
A few generations later, you've changed the animal significantly.
28:57
So one question I have is, are these ticks up leveled in some way because they seem to survive cold temperatures, hot temperature, it's like they are, they are so ruggedized that I wonder is this what these organisms have always been like or were was there any gain of function to the tick itself and or was there any gain of function that you see happening with the pathogens individually or collectively?
29:23
And I guess the third part of that is we can get to this later, but it sounds like some of this has to do with a cocktail of pathogens, that maybe there's a synergistic effect of multiple pathogens at once rather than, you know, just individually.
So is Lyme disease, I guess I'm asking, is it a multi species syndrome or is it truly caused by these spirochetes?
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Let's start start with gain of function.
Yes, on gain of function I'll explain that.
And yes, they tried to up level the ticks and then yes, it's they had a deliberate program to mix multiple pathogens.
31:22
I call that the Russian doll complex.
So let me start with the gain of function.
So Willie, when he first came, was taking multiple species of ticks and and he would put little pipettes in them and put slurries of diseases in their mouths because I was saying ticks and a parasite evolved together for many years.
31:50
He was trying to force feed them different pathogens so that to fight and then he would put them on little furry animals and see which mix would create the most virulent pathogen, which combination of tick and a germ.
32:07
And for example, he put rabies in ticks.
We're talking about rabies that is almost 100% deadly.
And he published, he published a paper on that in open source.
But until you have his lab notebooks and the reports to Port Dietrich, the bio weapons headquarters, you don't say, you don't think, oh, he wasn't doing that experiment for humanity, right?
32:35
So, so and you know, he put in the text, he put Venezuelan equine encephalitis from the liver of someone who died in Trinidad, Leptospirosis, which is the spirochete that you get in the tropics like Hawaii.
32:51
I mean, we were just starting the Korean War in the middle of the Korean War.
So he's looking for a take that would survive in Korea.
The commies, you know, that's cold in North.
So think of that as crude gain of function, AKA animal husbandry, finding the most, just like the way you take a Turkey and try to have the biggest white breast in the Turkey.
33:14
So, yeah.
And then the program after a while decided, well, the Army's very practical and they're saying we can't keep ticks alive and whatever germs alive in them inside a musician munitions stored for months.
33:31
So they said no way.
So then the the program evolved to mass producing just the tick borne diseases alone.
We're talking to anthrax, Venezuelan equine encephalitis, tularemia.
A lot of those can be spread by ticks in large beer tanks.
33:51
They would freeze dry them and then spray them from cluster bombs or on buoys or on the back of ships.
Is any of this legal to do?
I mean, isn't this illegal?
I know that.
I mean, I'm not shocked that government does a legal thing, but aren't there bio weapons treaties?
34:08
Like you're not supposed to do this?
Or was this allowed then at the time?
Well.
Geneva Protocol.
It was passed in 1925.
Russia and America never ratified it.
It got through one House of Congress here, but it was never ratified by the Senate.
34:26
So it was pretty much anything goes.
And if you protested that, well, you're not a patriot.
Right.
So you were saying though they were, so they stopped using the tick and they were just spraying the pathogen out or or depositing the pathogen onto landscapes?
34:42
Right.
So that and that created a revolution in genetic engineering because they would take those pathogens and they would try to force mutation.
So again, that's gain of function through radiation, through transfections.
35:02
So taking viruses and mixing them with bacteria with little snippets of DNA.
And now this is evolved to CRISPR.
So the precision is astounding on what they can do now, but still there was a unit of the CIA Black Ops embedded in Fort Detrick and they just would wander the halls and talk to scientists.
35:25
So, So what do you have for me like think of Q and James Bond.
So at like 1961, I discovered I talked to the the guy who actually did this, the company which was a plausible deniability contractor for the CIA.
35:45
They, the Kennedy brothers launched a program called the Cuba Project or Operation Mongoose.
And they had like 50 ideas on how to screw up the Cuban economy so that the people would revolt and throw out communist leader Fidel Castro.
36:04
So Project 33, some Project 33 B was dropping poison ticks on the Cuban sugar cane workers.
So I ended up randomly interviewing the guy who did that.
He didn't know that I just spent five years on the Lyme disease documentary.
36:22
It was a random birth party, birthday party for my the other side of the family in Texas.
And so he spilled the beans.
He was really drunk and then I did, but it's a single source story.
It's just a guy who just likes to tell stories at parties.
36:38
I interviewed him when he was sober several times, but still it was a single source story.
But then what happened is they started releasing the JFK assassination files, which are just, you know, 10s of thousands.
And I just searched on, searched those files and then I found Operation Mongoose sub project 33 being there.
37:02
It was they did 1 pilot study and they said this didn't work and they never did it again.
Because what happened, because I talked to the tick dropper, he had two boxes.
He didn't know what was in them.
Just the pilot said drop them.
37:18
He opens up the cockpit, cockpit door and you know there's a lot of blowback.
He rips open the boxes and dumps them and it's thousands and thousands of ticks.
So obviously he got some ticks on him.
37:34
He goes back home.
I I said, well, what did you do after that and said we had a ground operation.
I can't tell you.
He told me about the ticks but not whatever he was doing on the ground.
It's one of those sub projects and were.
They dropped.
37:49
Where were they dropping it from?
Was it a test drop here in the States or were they dropping it actually on Cuba?
On Cuba.
So it's like one of those.
They did.
They did this in the field.
They dropped these.
He was.
On a plane, it's probably the Air America 123.
It's, you know, air.
America.
38:05
The CIA sham pilot the sham airline.
So he flies back to home.
He has a newborn at home and he obviously didn't get all the ticks with whatever's in them.
I suspect it was Venezuelan equine encephalitis, artillery Amir or whatever, but his newborn ends up in the ICU with like 105 fever, just incredibly sick.
38:33
He's about to die of meningitis and luckily there was a resident on staff who was from Cuba.
He goes, I've seen, I've seen this many times and he just, you know, how to treat it.
And.
Luckily there was a resonant from that the tropics.
38:53
So anyways, the the point is through the 60s, they started moving away from stuffing plague and fleas and mosquitoes with Trinidad fever virus and ticks with bad stuff.
And they started doing the genetic engine, the crude genetic engineering.
39:12
And so in the late 60s it got really sophisticated and they started doing the overwhelming force or overwhelming.
There's a special term for it, but they would mix bacterias in, in a bacteria, they would mix viruses and a toxin in the slurry that they fed them.
39:34
So they would spray out a bacteria in this Russian doll scenario, and the people in the field would give their soldiers or the residents an antibiotic and that would bust open the cell wall, but it would release the toxin in the virus.
39:51
So it would completely overwhelm your immune system and create a crazy set of symptoms that no one could diagnose or treat.
I mean, it's untreatable, basically.
So when I heard this.
What because there was multiple causes and it would be hard to pin down what that?
40:09
Was yeah, the Russian doll.
Like, it's like opening a Russian doll and there's another evil pathogen in every layer.
And I was told this by the intelligent, like someone in the intelligence world.
So when I heard that, it's like, oh, that's really sounds like Lyme disease.
40:27
So recently, I went back to the Yale Medical Library, and the first person to collect evidence on what was going on around Lyme, CT was Pauline Murray, an angry mom.
Like I would say Lyme disease is a disease of angry moms.
40:45
Yeah.
I won't read them.
You'd listen to them.
So I looked at her handwritten notes of everyone in your neighborhood in Lyme, CT, and the symptoms were so incredibly freaky.
It's just like way more severe than what we're seeing with Lyme disease now.
41:01
So that just makes me think of the Russian doll syndrome.
There was something else there.
And certainly Willie said that, you know, was it a Rickettsial Rickettsia?
Was it a virus?
I don't know.
But the original outbreak was severe neurological issues.
41:18
So people were committing suicide.
People are going to psychiatrists.
They were being treated with ADHD medications and psychotropics, and the medical establishment had no idea what it was.
And then also there was this unusual joint swelling.
41:36
So Polly Murray's son, who I interviewed, said, you know, in Lyme, CT, we'd get on the school bus in elementary school and everybody would have crutches and knees swollen like balloons under their slack.
41:52
So the thing that surprises me is like, why hasn't anybody looked into this?
This is like an epidemiologist's dream.
It's like, you know, call her at the water pump.
And so then that led to the bio weapon thing, 'cause I believe that Willie was told let's just blame the whole disease on the Lyme spirochete Borelli burgdorferi, which he says, I wish it wasn't named after me now.
42:22
And and then people won't look into what else was in the ticks.
Well, does that mean that today, OK, I'm trying to, I want to make sure I word this right.
And by the way, I just want to say crazy about, you know, this guy dropping the ticks out of the plane and then bringing the disease home.
42:41
I think if I remember from your book, Willie and his wife both seem to have contracted tick borne illnesses at some point as well.
No, he.
Did.
I'm not sure about his wife.
His wife had issues, but.
Yeah, if that's what the issues are caused by or not, right.
But but OK.
42:57
So do you think today we're still dealing when we see Lyme disease today, are you suggesting that it might also be a Russian doll effect?
Or do you think that we're largely seeing symptoms caused by the Lyme spirochete?
It's on its own.
Does that make sense?
43:14
Because what you were just saying before?
If you if you study the outbreak of West Nile viruses like West Nile virus and other viruses, viruses strive to be good pathogen, good parasites.
43:29
They don't kill their hosts, right?
So they Peter out as they spread.
And so it feels like there was a virus or a really bad Rickettsial and a Rickettsia is so small it's almost a virus.
43:46
But I mean, obviously it's not a virus.
But I think that initial wave of neuro psych stuff dissipated on whatever that mystery pathogen is.
And Willie would not tell me what it was.
But we're just dealing with Lyme disease right now mostly.
44:05
And the underlying science, I believe, was corrupted because of the efforts to cover up that original outbreak, whatever that was.
Because you have two degrees in engineering, I'm I'm just going to wager a guess that you probably, like, didn't start off a conspiracy person, right?
44:30
It's my guess.
How has it been for you to uncover this?
Because I would imagine you're looking at it thinking like, OK, well, this is just one program.
And now we're seeing things all over the world seeming to come to light where it's like, oh, this kind of meddling seems to be going on in all kinds of places.
44:50
How have you slept at night with this kind of information?
And and how are you viewing current events?
Through a new lens, I guess.
Yeah, when I was I was at Stanford Medical School as a science writer for 10 years.
45:06
I got the tip from the tick dropper and a video of Willie saying, yeah, something there's something bio weapons related at at the Ground Zero of Lyme disease.
So halfway through.
So I'm in the medical school where everyone there is funded by NIH grants and the last thing in the world they want is to upset NIH and NIAID, which is run by Fauci.
45:31
So I was living a double life the last five years at Stanford, right?
I mean, I'd done the film.
I told my husband two weeks before the tick dropper incident, you know, I'm just going to go back to my life.
I got this good job.
But once the bio weapons thing, it's just like I realized it would die with Willie unless someone dug it out.
45:54
And I felt like after I almost died from these two tick borne diseases, I thought, you know, my life means absolutely nothing unless I do something significant and and that significant thing seem like I don't want any other family to go through what we went through.
46:09
It was such a brutal nightmare.
We thought I'd we'd leave our two young boys as orphans.
So it was hard like when I started reading about stuffing fleas with plague, the the most dead deadly disease on the planet that killed most of Europe several times.
46:31
You know, it's just dark, and it's just like, how can I do this?
But I knew it was real because I had the documents and the reports and eyewitness testimonies.
So I felt like it needed to come to light.
Because if you have these genetically engineered bugs, the normal take a Tylenol and go to bed isn't going to work.
46:53
And it was also at the root of these patients.
And you can see them in the film under her skin.
Who say I am really, really sick and the medical system ignoring them.
You know, it's just, it's not take 2 pills of doxy and call me in the morning.
47:10
That does not work for such an invasive germ.
So it was dark and then the book came out and we couldn't do the normal pre marketing because we were afraid the government would shut it down and.
47:26
Wow.
Yeah, right.
Right.
So it's just it landed and and I think you know the NIH who on the surfaces protecting us from dangerous diseases, but on the down low is making I.
47:45
Believe that 10 years ago, but.
Right.
And so the public, I was labeled, I was immediately labeled as a conspiracy theorist.
Come on podcast with a tinfoil hat.
In fact, I did.
I was on the podcast for the tinfoil hat.
So it was, it was sad to me.
48:04
And then what happened was Chris Smith of New Jersey, Republican lawmaker in the DoD budget, just out of the blue, he takes my book and says there it is right there, bitten.
This is a really credible book and we need to investigate this tick weaponization.
48:22
And all of a sudden everybody in the around the world is watching the DoD budget.
It's the biggest Piggy Bank on the planet.
Everybody wants some of that money.
So I was a laughing stock and then behind the scenes the NIH was figuring out ways to discredit me and the book.
48:41
So I have a chain of emails on that and I decided, you know, I can't, I can't fight NIH.
So I just went on every podcast I could because really my purpose isn't to sell a lot of books, it's to get the word out so people take tick bites seriously because there's more than meets the eye on these tick bites right now.
49:07
Do you think if we were to take I always hear because I have such an interest in like ancestral living and, and living on the landscape, I, I've been fascinated by the story of Otzi the Iceman from, you know, the Italian Alps.
Erin, I always hear that he was infected with Lyme disease.
49:28
So they say they found the spirochete in him and I've wondered for a long time about that.
In particular, I wonder if we were to look at its genome and compare it, are we dealing with the OK?
The reason that I hear that very often is why I hear it is because people use it to say, hey, this has always been here, this isn't something new.
49:47
This disease has been around.
Do you think that it's the same disease?
Like is this Lyme disease we have today?
Is, is Borrelia today the same Organism that it was?
I mean, obviously there's been some natural selection changes and stuff that will happen over 5000 years, but but has has that Organism fundamentally been changed?
50:05
If I get infected with it tomorrow, am I getting infected with something that has been altered by government programs?
Does that make sense?
Yeah.
So I don't let me start with the Otzi story.
I've talked to the people who sequenced it so.
50:22
Oh wow, all.
Right, of course, it's interesting to me.
And, and I mean think about Lyme disease.
We have trouble diagnosing it now, so how are you going to diagnose it in a 5300 year old?
PCR test man, what's your blot?
50:40
I know.
So a paper came out by a young scientist at Lawrence Livermore Labs and you know, they're interested in fast sequencing because if there's a a bio warfare outbreak, they want to fast sequence it and know how to deal with it.
And so he said he has, he's a super quant and he has libraries of all the pathogens in the world and he's figured out algorithms to fast to quickly identify them.
51:09
So he took the sequence from the French Italian team that sequenced it and rerun it with his more sophisticated libraries.
And he says they only sequence 60% of this Borrelia.
All you can say it's, it's part of that genre of Borrelia.
51:25
So it could be gingivitis, It could be syphilis, Maybe it was in Italy sleeping around, You know, you just.
Yeah.
Right.
Well, probably.
Yeah, Yeah.
That's all.
That's all they know about 60% and you can't say for sure.
51:40
It's brilliant, has it?
Become a cover story in a sense.
What do you think?
Do you think that this reason that everybody who's into this has heard that story about him having that, about the ice mummy having that disease, is that like a cover story that's emerged to say it's always been around or is it just a convenient thing to point?
51:58
To I know the three scientists that propagate that story and they know better and they're all part of the military industrial research establishment and they research tick bio weapons.
So I think they have elevated it even though they know better.
52:15
And then I back to the the French team and they said, yeah, the Lawrence Livermore guys, right OK, so let's let's go back to Lyme is a bio weapon.
So those three members of the disinformation team who get a lot of money to study tick, tick borne weapons, they've said, oh, that's ridiculous.
52:43
Lyme, there's no proof that Lyme has been weaponized.
And, and we take ticks from museums and it hasn't changed at all.
Well, we know from COVID, how many, how many ATG CS do you need to change to make it a bioweapon or make it something that's alien to a native population?
53:06
So they get sick.
No, not many.
And if you start reading the, the sequencing papers recently, a lot of them say Borelli Burgdorferi has, has had a rapid and unusual and mysterious evolution.
53:25
So what there's, I mean, they, they can only say so much, but what they're saying is that it, it hasn't slowly evolved over decades.
There's something unusual about the genome.
And if someone, I'm sure someone could prove it, if they're incentivized to prove that the NIH was messing with relapsing fevers in Willie's lab, He was, he was mixing and matching germs.
53:54
But I, I will say definitively, I have no evidence that it was engineered.
I just know there's a certain, it's very virulent around the late 60s, early 70s in Lyme, CT.
But that could be a mix of pathogens, and it could be that other weaponized germ that Willie referenced.
54:19
Which is the Swiss agent?
The Swiss agent, Yeah.
Right, which we think is a Rickettsia, but still remains unknown.
This still kind of remains unknown.
Unknown.
Unknown.
So yeah, it's I.
54:36
As I was finishing up the book, I tried to find Ground Zero blood that's in someone's freezer and have someone sequence it.
But the people who are at ground 0 collecting the blood aren't about to play nice with me, so I couldn't do that.
54:54
But still, CDC and their freezers probably has Ground Zero blood and they can screen it for everything and we'd know, but they don't want to know.
How do you look at living in this post Bio weapons, Pandora's box environment we're in now?
55:12
Because if I'm hearing you right, I'm dealing with up level ticks with up level pathogens in quantities that are nothing like the world I grew up in.
And I think there's a lot of people who, you know, this all comes at the same time as AI and the metaverse and people spending so much of their time not only in the built environment, but now the digital environment and less time in the natural world.
55:40
They're being encouraged and incentivized to stay out of nature.
And then now you have this thing that's like almost invisible to the naked eye for most people.
They have, they believe they're dropping out of trees.
You know, people think all kinds of weird stuff, right?
They don't understand sort of how they're getting on them.
55:57
They don't want to go near the woods.
They don't want to go near the trails.
They certainly don't want to walk through a field of tall grass a lot of times.
And my concern for humanity is that we have like a, a true need to be a natural environments and, and to get out of built in digital environments.
56:16
How do you look at that?
I mean, you've actually been infected, went through a true nightmare scenario.
Does that keep you out of the outdoors?
And what do you say to people who are are terrified to go into nature because of these ticks?
Yeah, and I know a lot of people like that now.
56:32
I, I just, I think we're part of nature and we need to fight back and being in nature as best we can.
I did moved to Utah rather than Martha's Vineyard.
I mean, I'm much fewer tickers ticks here.
56:51
There is, but it, I, I hike everyday.
So I, one way to think about it is you go to Africa and you do prophylactic anti malarials.
So you have to protect yourself and your family.
57:07
And it's going to take a little work, but it's worth it.
That's my opinion.
And my, my role on this planet, I think is just to raise awareness.
So, you know, put, put some sort of repellent on you.
57:22
There's natural solutions and there's like Permethrin, which is actually banned in Canada.
They're being attacked by ticks and they can't use Permethrin.
Permethrin so I would for protecting your yard like landscaping and predicting yourself.
57:37
I I like the website Tick encounter.
It's the University of Rhode Island.
They have a tick problem and then tick checks.
You just got to do it.
Twice a day long mirror full.
Naked and then OK.
57:56
The tick draggers I know do prophylactic doxycycling.
Tick dagger somebody who who goes out into the field with the sheet and counts.
Ticks like jars like this big of doxycycline the Israeli military I heard this week.
58:13
For the soldiers in the field, if they pull out a tick, they take 3 pills of doxycycline on the first day, and then five single pills on the the second day.
For a total of 800 milligrams, Yeah, but that I, I wanted to talk about that.
58:31
So I'll let you complete that thought.
Though the CDC is pushing O2 pills of doxy, 300 milligrams will cure Lyme, that is just a bunch of bunk and CD CS own scientist has run a study and says that's bunk.
58:49
Joe Buriscano, who's probably treated more aligned patients than anybody from Long Island.
He usually recommends if you pull out in the gorge, tick six weeks of doxycycline.
Six weeks.
Yeah, I mean what happens if you just take 2 pills of doxycycline?
59:07
You're just forcing the spirochetes to dig deeper into your brain and your immune protected sites, your joints, etcetera.
I would imagine you also kill off susceptible spirochetes, but then ones that are more resistant to the doxy are going to be the survivor and reproducing ones in your blood so.
59:25
Right, I've often thought there's I have nothing in writing about this.
The reason why doxycycline which doesn't even kill spirochetes really well the penicillin do.
The reason why I was recommended is they're more worried about the weaponized ricatsia because doxycycline is the frontline for the weaponized, but I have no proof on that.
59:47
It's just that would make sense because again, the tick bites you, your immune system is suppressed for two weeks.
And what's going to get you is if your immune system is sleeping, why while three different tick borne diseases spread in your body at once.
1:00:03
You know, so the doxycycline would waylay the notorious, you know, spotted fever, Rickettsia.
OK, so the Rickettsy is more susceptible to the doxy because I, you know, I keep antibiotics here at home.
1:00:19
I'm not an antibiotic user, but I, I keep them and I've my tick checks are vigilant.
And my, my wife and I, we are saying is may you feel every tick.
And we, we've become hyper, hyper, hyper sensitive such that we wake up out of a dead sleep with a tick on our fingers because it's like you wake up and you just grab it, you know, And it's like we've gotten very, very good at finding them.
1:00:40
Here too.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know.
It's, well, I have a whole protocol, you know, I find them.
So we've been really blessed, not been bitten ourselves.
But a lot of people come to visit and you warn them and warn them, and then you end up having to give them doxies.
But so you think like an amoxicillin or a penicillin is also a valuable treatment specifically for Borrelia?
1:01:06
Yes, there there's some studies, a lot of studies in Petri dishes and the ceilings are much more effective than the doxycyclines.
I mean the technical word is doxycycline is bacterial static and then penicillins bacterial killing.
1:01:24
There's like a new research called azacillin, but I think some clinical trials, but then you have penicillin allergies.
So that's maybe another reason they didn't recommend penicillins as frontline.
But but really, and then if you get the chronic form of the disease, that's a different ball game.
1:01:45
But I'm saying early, like I'm not a doctor, but you know, a short course of doxycycline, longer than two pills, You'll, you'll never look back and you won't be taking that future hellish rat hole timeline that I did.
1:02:05
I'm always just like my friend.
I have a friend recently where he's like, I don't know, I'm not sure.
I'm like I don't just do it just.
And I'm, I'm so the opposite of that when it comes to a pharmaceutical drugs.
That's I've always been the opposite of that.
But I, this is 1 area where I just like don't mess around with these diseases.
1:02:21
They are so severe and so serious.
So what's going on in the vaccine space?
I think so many people are after what happened with COVID.
I think it was that realization you're like, wait a second.
So this is this vaccine is not even a vaccine, first of all, second, it's not doesn't prevent the disease.
1:02:38
You getting the disease that doesn't prevent you developing the disease, that doesn't stop you from transmitting the disease.
Like what is this right?
So we've been exposed to this new class of vaccines.
What is this vaccine I'm hearing about for Lyme, this Pfizer vaccine?
Is it a traditional vaccine or is it, you know, like a what do they call those the aren't mRNA vaccine?
1:03:01
What?
What kind of vaccine is it and is it coming to market?
It is in FDA approval right now.
OK.
So it's not MRNIA, it's sort of takes the same approach as the first two Lyme vaccines during the 90s that were pulled off the market.
1:03:22
I don't really know much about that, actually, if there's anything you want to say about it.
I'm not familiar with that story.
So cannot took theirs off right away because in the trials they saw there were a lot of adverse effects.
Glaxo, I don't know what it was called, but Glaxo Smith, Kline had a similar, similar one, but they took it to market anyways and it had a lot of adverse effects because the protein that they, I mean the spirochete, they take a snippet, A molecular snippet of the two proteins on the bug they injected in you and it's theoretically was supposed to create an immune system response.
1:04:11
But what happened is those proteins were the proteins that were on the surface of the spirochete when it was in the gut of the tick.
And once warm blood rushes into the tick, it changes its surface proteins so it can stick to red blood cells and take the supershuttle to your brain.
1:04:33
So then they changed the, the definition of success for that vaccine so that oh, what happens is the ticks attached for several days, one or two days, and then the blood goes into the tick and it kills the spirochetes in the gut of the tick.
1:04:56
So if you know anything about ticks, that's a sort of a flawed strategy because there can be spirochetes in the mouth of the tick, in the saliva, and you'll get infected right away.
And who cares if you're killing the spirochetes in the gut?
1:05:12
It's already in your bloodstream.
The other thing is what about the 20 other germs that are in the tick that can be in the slide of like very deadly Poisson virus and Heartland virus and the sugar molecule that creates alpha gal red meat allergies, What about those?
1:05:32
They're transmitted very quickly, right?
Like those can all be transmitted upon being bitten.
They don't need that long, you know, feeding time, right?
Yeah, once they hit a vein and then it's blood strained, it's like, oh, you're walking on a in a ghetto and some IV drug use to get you with a needle.
1:05:49
That's what's that's what happens.
Mystery juice.
So this new vaccine uses the same strategy or we're going to kill the spirochetes in the gut.
Oh, but we picked safer surface proteins.
1:06:06
So it's not going to harm, It's not close to your myelin nerve sheets.
It's not going to give you an autoimmune disease for the rest of your life.
That's the strategy.
OK.
We haven't seen the data yet.
The data was that it takes three shots in the first year just to get to 72% efficacy.
1:06:28
Oh my goodness.
Is that practically or economically a good vaccine?
I don't know they're.
Going to sell a lot of it.
They're going to sell a lot of it because they've scared people half to death and they're going to sell a kind of it.
And then we're going to watch all the we're going to watch all the adverse effects roll in.
1:06:47
They're going to deny them.
They're going to have total immunity from it.
I mean, this story is getting it's like the fool me once.
It's like how many times, man, this stuff is hard to hear.
It's it really is frustrating.
But but there is hope.
There is hope.
On me.
1:07:04
Harsus has a pill in the clinical trial that you take when you're going to go on a hiking trip on the Blue Ridge Mountains or whatever.
Take a pill.
It's just like the pill for your dog.
It makes you taste bad to ticks.
Like I like that concept better.
1:07:21
I haven't seen ADA, but I know a lot of people who've been following it and they think that's the approach because then you're going to protect from the 20 other germs and it's not a forever thing floating around in your bloodstream with adjuvants, they're going to evoke autoimmune disease.
1:07:40
It's.
Right.
Like going to Africa, I'm going to take prophylactic doxycycline one while I'm in the unsafe place.
And you moved to where you are.
Did you move there specifically because of you wanted to get away from ticks or I mean, did you have other motives?
I assume it wasn't just that, or was it just that?
1:07:57
Well, we're in California, so there are a lot of issues with California.
And I have, I have family here.
And my new book, which is about the Skull Valley incident in Utah, another military accident.
It's here.
So it was easier to do my research.
1:08:13
So it was a family and oh, this is a good story to write about.
Since I'm here, it's the same, it's the same theme.
It's like the military industrial complex thinking it's OK to kill more Americans with their weapons than enemies.
1:08:30
Right.
Yeah.
Do you at this point feel that this was accidental or do you feel like there's anything more nefarious?
What's happened with ticks over the years?
I mean, you know, it's like you get online now.
1:08:47
And I mean, if you're black pilled, you can go pretty into some pretty dark places, you know, and, and I think that that Overton window has shifted so much, right?
I kind of joke with people today.
It's like, hey, if 20 years ago I told you that Fox News would say that there's four types of, you know, alien beings coming to our planet, you know, and that, you know, there's a giant international pedophilic sex ring involving presidents and, you know, former, you know, and like monarchs like this seems just seems like absurd.
1:09:18
But that's like our headlines now.
And it's making it easier to go to places dark weather, imaginary or real.
So I'm curious how black pilled this has left you I guess.
Yeah, 20 years ago when I first got bitten, I never would have imagined that this much would have been revealed.
1:09:38
So I guess I'm more of a critical thinker.
I mean, I'm an engineer by training, so I need data.
I'm not, I'm not going to go hair on fire to sell books or whatever.
But like, for example, this whole rumor of tick boxes, it's like, well, I'm I need to get to the bottom of this, this it sounds ridiculous because we haven't big enough of a tick problem.
1:09:59
We don't need Pfizer someone dropping any more ticks in Missouri.
But you know, I chased that down.
It was one health influencer who heard it at a private conference and and it was on one farmer and it wasn't verified.
1:10:17
And so this luckily, there's this hardcore journalist at Snopes and he called 100 health agencies in Missouri and said no one has heard stories of tick boxes.
So all of a sudden tick boxes are like click bait.
1:10:33
Right.
I saw quite a lot of videos come up on my feed where, you know, and again, we're in that era.
It's like you just don't know what's real.
Things look real and they're not.
You know, I mean, one day it's like a video of baby dinosaurs in China.
They're breeding them.
You're like, I can't.
And it looks real, but I know it's not.
1:10:48
You know, it's like I see guys walking up to these boxes and fields and you're like, I just don't know.
It looks like, you know, kind of Blair Witch footage where you're like that.
Maybe it is, maybe does it.
But it did seem preposterous, like you said, in relationship to how many ticks there are on the landscape.
Like why would you spread any of this?
But then, you know, what do you think about for instance, I mean, do you think that that we will find out that there's more to the alpha gal allergy story?
1:11:13
You know, there's a lot of people wanting to link it to fake meat products to Agenda 2030 to the World Economic Forum's agenda.
Unfortunately, we have seen people at the World Economic Forum suggesting that it would be immoral to stop the spread of alpha gal allergy.
We've seen of course, that beneficial blood sucking paper that came out.
1:11:31
And so there is some people are connecting those dots not for no reason.
What do you think about the conclusions they're reaching?
Or do you think that the alpha gal spread is?
I know you don't think it's a completely natural thing because it sounds like these ticks were moved around, but do you think there's anything more to that story?
1:11:51
So having done the deep dive on the bio weapons program of the Cold War.
So I did it for the first book, I've done it for the second book.
There's nothing like the alpha gal thing in the Cold War bioweapons, bread crumbs that I've gone through.
1:12:08
It could be something more modern related to population control.
I mean, I just don't know.
I like data.
I haven't found any data.
I have some credible scientist people that thinks it might be one of the additives to the vaccines that is making it worse.
1:12:29
I mean, if you look at bovine products, they're just in everything now.
It's hard for a vegan to get by.
So I but I don't know.
I don't know.
I'm just, I keep an open mind.
1:12:44
I mean, I read my Daily Stoic and there's just so much going on now.
You have to protect your psyche.
Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely.
Talk about this is my family, I'm going to protect myself, my mental health, my family and people are wanting to distract you so you won't look at what's important and just realize that and.
1:13:04
Why do you think?
Why do you think that is?
We're just, I mean, we're got this ancient primate brain that responds to fight or flight, and it's easy to control people that way.
1:13:21
And we just have to step back every morning.
It's like, Oh my gosh, I'm alive.
This place is pretty good.
I have washing machines, Elliot, whole hoods.
This is pretty.
And yeah, now I'm somewhat retired and I can wake up every morning and work on what I think is important, not what someone else wants me to do like you.
1:13:44
I want to just drill on this one more time.
You can just tell, you can just pass if you want, but it's like when you see that happening, obviously we are being manipulated in that way.
And, and a lot of it can be attributed to just financial incentives, perverse financial incentives.
I learn more towards like spiritual explanations because I just can't understand.
1:14:06
I'm watching my species commit suicide, but worse, I'm watching my species be groomed into committing suicide.
Like these awful things that you see happen to kids on the Internet.
It's like happening to our species, like we're being convinced to destroy ourselves.
It seems like on almost every front I can see.
1:14:23
And I have a hard time going.
Well, it's just because people are greedy and they want money.
I mean, I think that's one of the mechanisms by which it's happening.
But do you know, when you look at all this stuff going on and, and like you said, you actually have to, we're in an era now where you have to protect your psyche and remember to just spend time with the people you love and, and, and laugh and, and enjoy each other.
1:14:44
You know, do you how, how do you like make sense of it?
Well, I'm a researcher by nature and I I read a lot on the nature of reality, the nature of consciousness, the whole alien rabbit hole.
1:15:04
I was home of Skinwalker Ranch.
Yeah.
There, there is something going on that is more than money, but it's above my species level right now to understand.
Yeah, I know.
1:15:19
It's like we're all speculating, and it's like this.
You can see the shadow of it, but you can't quite see the thing itself.
It's a very weird time.
Well, tell us about your, you know, whatever you'd like to say about your new book.
Like, when can we expect it out?
And then where do people go in the meantime to get this book, which I really, really recommend, I think especially if you live in a place where ticks are endemic.
1:15:41
I mean, you, you need to read the book.
But but yeah, where do you, where do you like to send people?
I would I would say if you're in the middle of a chronic disease, see the film first.
It's streaming in multiple places.
It's called Just Google Under Our Skin and you can watch it for free and practically a few bucks.
1:16:00
I'm not sure where it is now because I don't own the rights.
That owned.
By the the director Andy Wilson And because that's a kinder and gentler intro, it'll explain to your relatives what you're going through.
You will see the set of symptoms that people are diagnosed with, misdiagnosed with and kinder and gentler.
1:16:21
Then when you're when you're in your treatment, you can see bitten and just realized sort of the dark nefarious history of it.
I mean, we did 100%.
We had a tick weaponization program.
1:16:36
Not sure where Lyme disease falls into the genetically modified, but it hasn't been proven yet.
And then I would say, so my book will be out next year, probably in the spring.
1:16:52
It's just taking forever.
There's too many Trump books coming out or something.
But it's it's like bitten.
I wanted to make a good story.
So it's educational and it's very human centered.
1:17:08
Like one of the central questions is Willie Burgdorfer.
How does he go from this ambitious, ambitious, do good scientist to creating insects of mass destruction?
Like how does a person go through the ark?
And then in the end he sort of goes to the the light.
1:17:28
Some people will never forgive him for what he did, but.
I'm sure he thought he was.
I mean, you that that Patriot card can get people to do a lot of things.
You know, people really believe in the purpose.
Yeah, in Skull Valley it's the same.
1:17:46
I go deeper dive, like how does a person become a Nazi prison guard and hand you some soap as you go into the gas chamber?
And this, this deals mostly with the chemical weapons program and the people that were working with those chemicals that started out as insecticides in Germany and ended up being really horrendous weapons.
1:18:11
So it's though it's entertaining, weird and educational too.
Yeah, well, I'm looking forward to it.
And then your Instagram account or anything like that you want to share with people.
So I think I have Chris newby.com, which has all the a lot of original documents on Bitten if you want to read them, the CIA documents or whatever.
1:18:36
And I'll be updating that for the new book when it's orderable.
But I think my sub stack under sub stack Chris Newby, that's where I'm putting my ongoing research.
As I gather more bitten research then I will be slapping it up there and it's free.
1:18:56
Unless you feel like just donating, but it's free for everybody.
I, I just want to say, I'm sure you hear this all the time, but you're a fantastic writer, first of all, and I just want to thank you for your work because like you said, it seems like this would be an area you'd think that so many people would have wanted to, it just, it fell to you, you know, and you obviously risked a lot to take it on.
1:19:20
I'm sorry you had to go through such a horrible medical experience to, to be qualified to tell the story.
But I'm really grateful that you told it.
As somebody living in tit country, your book had a huge impact on me.
And I think it's going to have a huge impact on so many people for a long time to come.
1:19:37
So just thank you for your work and thank you for coming on today.
I really appreciate you.
Well, thanks for saying all those nice things and I'm glad it's helped you and your family too.